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  1. #1
    Bambino di Agrigento Apollinaire Charisme's Avatar
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    The illusion of free will and its purpose.

    Beneath the level of awareness, our brains are in constant communication.. constant negotiation.. deciding on everybody's next word, next action, etc.

    What you call the "subconscious" is actually a shared negotiation space that all humans and sentient life are plugged into. You know why you can't access your subconscious thoughts? Because, in a way, they don't belong to you. The contents of the subconscious belong to the hivemind.

    The illusion of being autonomous individuals freely deciding on our actions is necessary to give emotional salience to events. The more emotional substance (aka significance) an event possesses to us, the easier it is for our conscious brain to encode it into the shared subconscious for later negotiations.

    Free will doesn't exist. It's an illusion.

    But it's an illusion with a purpose.

    The purpose of "free will" is assigning emotional salience to things and transmitting them to the shared negotiation space.

    We are evolutionarily bound through the negotiation space.

    Thoughts?
    UPDATED: Light-Lyric Tenor (E2-E5-G6)
    GOALS: Chiaroscuro

    Itís so easy to laugh. Itís so easy to hate. It takes guts to be gentle and kind.

  2. #2
    Administrators doctor_wp's Avatar
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    Yes, free will is illusory but walk us through your second point


    I tried to teach nigguhs how to be
    kings


    And all they ever wanted to be was
    soldiers.



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  3. #3
    Bambino di Agrigento Apollinaire Charisme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by doctor_wp View Post
    Yes, free will is illusory but walk us through your second point
    What exactly?

    There is no illusion of free will without a corresponding illusion of selfhood

    Selfhood is necessary for events to have emotional weight.

    Our experiences are shared in the realm of a shared unconscious space.

    This is how we intuitively pick up on things without any instruction.

    This is how birds know how to fine tune a mating melody.
    UPDATED: Light-Lyric Tenor (E2-E5-G6)
    GOALS: Chiaroscuro

    Itís so easy to laugh. Itís so easy to hate. It takes guts to be gentle and kind.

  4. #4
    Administrators doctor_wp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apollinaire Charisme View Post
    What exactly?

    There is no illusion of free will without a corresponding illusion of selfhood

    Selfhood is necessary for events to have emotional weight.

    Our experiences are shared in the realm of a shared unconscious space.

    This is how we intuitively pick up on things without any instruction.

    This is how birds know how to fine tune a mating melody.
    Your point is fleeting through my fingertips. The idea of self is shaped via environment. How are you tying intuition into free will?


    I tried to teach nigguhs how to be
    kings


    And all they ever wanted to be was
    soldiers.



    Instagram: doctor_wp

  5. #5
    Bambino di Agrigento Apollinaire Charisme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by doctor_wp View Post
    Your point is fleeting through my fingertips. The idea of self is shaped via environment. How are you tying intuition into free will?
    There is the culturally constructed self

    And there's a base level self. A feeling of being an autonomous organism in control of your own actions.

    Without this illusion, events have no meaning, because things like guilt/joy/fear/ etc. can't be assigned to them; if we share a collective subconscious (as I'm postulating), we wouldn't be able to share emotionally significant information via shared memories
    Last edited by Apollinaire Charisme; 09-20-2022 at 01:58 AM.
    UPDATED: Light-Lyric Tenor (E2-E5-G6)
    GOALS: Chiaroscuro

    Itís so easy to laugh. Itís so easy to hate. It takes guts to be gentle and kind.

  6. #6
    Bambino di Agrigento Apollinaire Charisme's Avatar
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    Typing on phone is a serious bitch.
    UPDATED: Light-Lyric Tenor (E2-E5-G6)
    GOALS: Chiaroscuro

    Itís so easy to laugh. Itís so easy to hate. It takes guts to be gentle and kind.

  7. #7
    Administrators doctor_wp's Avatar
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    Word, I respect the view, it’s good to get the brain juices flowing.


    I tried to teach nigguhs how to be
    kings


    And all they ever wanted to be was
    soldiers.



    Instagram: doctor_wp

  8. #8
    AWSM +F Sir Bustalot's Avatar
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    I dont feel theres two selves in reality. But agree our brains are fragmented. We think a thought, and we think the thought is different from us, you get angry, and you say i have anger, basically saying you and anger are two diff objects. When actually the anger is the same as you...your thoughts are the same as you are, what goes on in your head is the same as the thought of "me"

    And meaning, does meaning exist outside of thinking? Does a tree have a meaning? The word tree does. But a tree has no meaning. Meaning comes from words and ideas

    Does love have a meaning? Or does the word and ideas we have about love have the meaning, and love itself is its own thing?

    We as humans have a lot of ideas, and ideas about ideas.

    Our brains are conditioned to want meaning i think. I dont think that to live a compassionate life there has to be a meaning.

    Also i think we have the brain of mankind. I think fundamentally no matter where you go on the planet all our brains work the same way. Slight diffs with temperaments and shit, but underneath it all were the same. So my consciousness is human consciousness not my very own personal one.

    I dont think thought is at all sacred, and generally shouldnt be regarded as so important and always inquired into
    Outwardly there is cronological time. The mind has applied this internally, it says, logically there is time its obvious. So then the mind thinks within time. I am a little depressed now, but i will get to a state of non depression later. The now and later is the time. Takes time to get from here to there. This is also creating a duality. Two things. I am this(the now), i will be that(the later). Simple things like this make you believe in theres a me controlling the thinking.
    nawmchomsky?

  9. #9
    Bambino di Agrigento Apollinaire Charisme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Bustalot View Post
    I dont feel theres two selves in reality. But agree our brains are fragmented. We think a thought, and we think the thought is different from us, you get angry, and you say i have anger, basically saying you and anger are two diff objects. When actually the anger is the same as you...your thoughts are the same as you are, what goes on in your head is the same as the thought of "me"

    And meaning, does meaning exist outside of thinking? Does a tree have a meaning? The word tree does. But a tree has no meaning. Meaning comes from words and ideas

    Does love have a meaning? Or does the word and ideas we have about love have the meaning, and love itself is its own thing?

    We as humans have a lot of ideas, and ideas about ideas.

    Our brains are conditioned to want meaning i think. I dont think that to live a compassionate life there has to be a meaning.

    Also i think we have the brain of mankind. I think fundamentally no matter where you go on the planet all our brains work the same way. Slight diffs with temperaments and shit, but underneath it all were the same. So my consciousness is human consciousness not my very own personal one.

    I dont think thought is at all sacred, and generally shouldnt be regarded as so important and always inquired into
    Thinking and meaning precedes language.

    Meaning is a sensory experience. You can't deny there is meaning to an experience any more than you can deny that you are experiencing something.
    UPDATED: Light-Lyric Tenor (E2-E5-G6)
    GOALS: Chiaroscuro

    Itís so easy to laugh. Itís so easy to hate. It takes guts to be gentle and kind.

  10. #10
    AWSM +F Sir Bustalot's Avatar
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    exactly, outside of us, things dont have a meaning. We give things meaning.

    love has no meaning. Love itself is not the word love and never will be. The word points to a thing. What is love? is love sensation? is love remembering pleasure? is love jealousy? and control? is love attatchment? Nope yet all those things are present in the way humans love. What you think about love is an idea, a concept. Love is neither. You can say ohh well real love doesnt have anger, jealousy, control, attatchment... but thats a fairytale. The way humans love today and right now contains all of that.

    say ancient man busts a nut. Doesnt have a word for it. Doesnt matter. The process is the same.
    Before there was a word for it there was a sensation which then we attatch to because we enjoy it and remember enjoying it, enjoy its security in the continuation of it, we want it to happen again. Same process in naming it. Sensation, its remembered you had it before, and you remember you enjoyed it, now you just have a word/symbol for it and so instead of just having an orgasm youre thinking and remember and wanting what you had all the times before, you feel all the memories and sensations of it from the past. Now that we have language its just easier and more superficial because we simplify things with a word and think the thing is the word.
    Outwardly there is cronological time. The mind has applied this internally, it says, logically there is time its obvious. So then the mind thinks within time. I am a little depressed now, but i will get to a state of non depression later. The now and later is the time. Takes time to get from here to there. This is also creating a duality. Two things. I am this(the now), i will be that(the later). Simple things like this make you believe in theres a me controlling the thinking.
    nawmchomsky?

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